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  #21  
Old Saturday, July 01, 2006
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@Greek = U seem to be very knive of the "reformation" history of civil services of Pkistan. Report me one incident when the reforms in services have beem undone??!!! If u donot knwo then better to remain silent! Still u live in Greek age!


@Aristotl2= Mr. U donot know nitty gritty of civil services. Ur posting is based on just self deception. U are urself not sure abt ur career as u told me urself, how u comment abt others and nice group like PSP. One thing more, DMGs are no more managers, but customer services officers of Nazims and Personal Secratries of minsters. I agree with Waheed that era of dogmatism is over, and Aristotle needs to study and analyse the things properly. He does not have basic knowledge of Services Structure.

@Waheed== Dear how Aristotle is going to tell u abt differnce b/w DMG and PSP....Big joke with u Waheed. Aristotle ask me abt services et al, i donot know how will he guide u!!!! be careful of quacks. lolozzz

@ZuBaloch= u look more vampire rather than normal guy in ur picture..lolzzz U say DMG has remained elite group throughout...but u have not mentioned what "throguht out" what??: is it tunnel, pipleline.......but be sure It has not been elite gropu through out the histroy of Pakistan. As a matter of fact, DMGs through out the history of Pak has remain more "reformed" or deformed service and devolution of Power was last nail in its coffin. U say PSP can only become secretary of interior not of any other minsitry. Bachay, u donot know. Kamal Shah is on deputation, otherwise PSP are not entitled to become secretaries. Secretary is politcal post, even any ranker can grab it, any CSS cader boy, even of information gropu, can hold it if he is politcial backing. and in Pakistan COAS can become Cheif Executive (like a corporate compnay) and President till he dies, and retired generals can become secretaries then, thus DMGs future become uncertain itself. what is strange, its Pakistan wher might is right and PSP is gropu where might is right in real sense. I think u have read old books of Khalid bin Saeed on bureaucracy, time has changed and up date urself rather than to post redundunt information abt DMG.
I am suspicious of ur mental health too: how can a person who is not even FSc become Prime minister at the age of 60 or minsiter at the age of 40, when he is not graduate according to LFO and 17th amendment!! so i said u r stil living in stone age or hullucinating!! And note, Nobody's emotions are hurted, u continue to enjoy ur freedom of expression with due regard for religion and respect of others. But mr. Next time come with study and facts, not just with ur own "ideas" of ur own own WORLD.
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  #22  
Old Saturday, July 01, 2006
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Post New Reforms In Police Service

@SONIA
PSP group is also losing its worth & pride because Pervaiz Ellahi is appointing ASPs & DSPs in every police station as supervisor police officers and they will have work like an SHO
A NEW DEVOLUTION IN PSP
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  #23  
Old Sunday, July 02, 2006
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Respected members!

AOA!

May these lines find you in the best of your conditions (Aameen)

I have been watching the ongoing debate about DMG and PSP for a little time now. Everybody has tried to express his/her views in whatever manner he/she has deemed appropriate. Somebody has been objective and someone has been subjective. The thing which matters is “to exhale some words” So whatever is in somebody’s brains, he/she will spell them out. The knowledge can never be perfect and of the people who are just observers of something and not the practitioners, knowledge usually is superficial. I hereby, with pleasure, like to acknowledge that, like almost all the contributors in this forum, I am a pursuer of CSP and not AN OFFICER OF CSP therefore whatever bad facts I share here are due to my superficial knowledge and whatever good I share here is due to that bit of eloquence which has been a special BLESSING of ALLAH (SWT). Thus, as I have already mentioned in my previous mail, I am sorry in advance if I hurt somebody’s position not only due to my lines of reasoning but also due to my superficial knowledge but know all that my intentions are good and altruistic.

Ps: When something is said or stated, the literal meanings, if taken, always frustrate the person. That’s why some people can never understand the real thought which wears the cloak of words.

With best of regards,

AH.
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  #24  
Old Sunday, July 02, 2006
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Default Stop acting like Gadfly....

@sonia
With all due respect...N ..plz stop acting like GADFLY..grow up babe u r one of thoes who do right things on wrong time..right time for u was the time when u failed in Essay paper tht was the time for u 2 prove ur wisdom.........

Secondly,despite of the fact that u r the sis of District Police Officer Nankana sahib Zulfiqar Hameed(as told by you in our private chat-same chat in which i asked u to guide me ...as mentioned by u in ur earliar post) u know very little about POLICE.In order to know what police means u need to work with ur bro........rite now i m bizzy so i will send spe post just 4 u later on..

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  #25  
Old Thursday, October 18, 2007
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Default Before & After Views about DMG of 34th CTP CSPs

A year & a half back when I took first step towards css & was knowing about the different service groups & specially the post conditions after devolution in DMG group & its future.

I've seen today after such long time this thread & was very much happy to see that most of participants are CSPs now 34th, 35th Common.

So now my query is to all the CSPs of 34th Common who posted in this thread that are still there thoughts are the same as they were a year & half back or the view is different after joining the CTP & stepping into civil service. bro Ammerkhattak 34th CTP r in DMG & Waheed---------- Sir plz kindly post your experience & views now about DMG & its standing & future after devolution.

thnx,
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Noman !
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  #26  
Old Friday, October 19, 2007
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Between DMG and PSP there is no comparison after devolution. A DDOR is a pitiable job. You collect revenue from poor farmers who have got nothing to pay. Decide some cases about revenue matter. A couple of Tehsildars and an army of patwaris will keep on greaseing their palms and making DDOR ultimately responsible. As for as DCO is concerned It takes fifteen years to reach there. and now keeping in view the provincial autonomy more and more officers from provincial management are being appointed on this post, particularly in Punjab. I believe that a DDOR can't even be compared with AC Income Tax(Job of both of officers is revenue collection, one under Federal jurisdiction and other(Agricultural) under Provincial Jurisdiction). How ever it is better for DMG when they are working in some secreteriat or Federal Institution. If DMG is One Down preority in CSS it's reason (as already explained by many friends) is that they are waiting for good times when they would be able to exert some influence on a weak political government to undo the Local Govt.

Last edited by Zain.ul.Abidin; Friday, October 19, 2007 at 01:11 PM.
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  #27  
Old Friday, October 19, 2007
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It seems that the DMG spark (which remained as the dazzling & all in all in power since 1947) is now a legacy. And the fresh CSPs who dreamed to be posted as Assistant Commissioner from the start of their career is an old dream now, perhaps !

Besides power, how much the devloution has affected the privildges with respect to housing, vehicle, servants & facilites e.g. phone limit etc. & how has it affected the promotion trend & diversity of work.

Also, will now the old trend be intact of posting DMG senior officers on deputation to govt corporations or will that be history too !

Finally, will there be a reverse, if happened ever to the devolution of DMG after the present govt tenure is over. Or they'll remain intact like that of the devolution done to Civil Service by Z.A. Bhutto remained intact even after his death.

sincerely,
Noman !
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  #28  
Old Sunday, October 21, 2007
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noman thanx 2 u 4 ur revival of this thread. i had not seen that before so it really gave me a pleasant feeling after reading arguments of different ppl----- a few childish and a few mature arguments. it is also interesting 2 note that the thread started anly about AC post but then it converted into the tussle btw DMG and PSP.
as far as DMG is concerned, no doubt that now-a-days , in the start, there is no comparison between ASP and DDOR. but if u look the whole growth of DMG, it is still matchless. DCO is really an attractive post under whom 45 deptts r working. yes it takes time 2 reach 2 DCO and time span should b there as young officers with experence of 6-7 yrs cannot run the distt as DCO. ( remember they could run the distt as DC after 6-7 yrs) coz DCO has 2 look after each and every matter which DC was not supposed 2 b.
now i ll like 2 give a new side of analysis.
1. IN 2001, WHAT WAS THE CONDITION OF DMG, AND NOW WHAT IS THEIR CONDITION?
2. 40% OF L.G ORDINANCE HAS BEEN CHANGED AND ALL THESE AMMENDMENTS FAVOUREDE DMG ( NOT EVEN A SINGLE ONE FAVOURED DISTT NAZIM).
3. WITH THE RETURN OF PRICE MAJISTRACY, THE POSITION OF DDO-R HAS BECOME MUCH BETTER
4. A NEW POLICE, CALLED MUNICIPAL POLICE, IS ALSO GOING 2 B RECRUITED 4 PRICE CONTROL ETC WHICH WILL WORK UNDER THE COMMAND OF DDO-R AT TEHSIL LEVEL AND EDO-R AT DISTT LEVEL. THIS IS 2 LESSEN THE BURDEN ON POLICE WHICH LL SEE LAW N ORDER.
NOW IMAGINE THE POSITION OF DDO-R WHO LL BE THE COMMANDER OF AN ARMED FORCE WHICH WILL B FULLY EQUIPPED WITH ARMS AND VEHICLES.
5. VIRTUALLY DDO-Rs R WORKING MORE THAN REV. COLLECTION ONLY. THEY DO DUTIES IN FLOOD RELIEF, ARRANGEMENT OF MANY OTHER ACTIVITIES AT TEHSIL LEVEL.
6. MOREOVER, DDO-R ENJOY ALL THE FACILITIES( HOUSE, VEHICLE ETC) WHICH OLD AC USED.
7. IF U CONSIDER FROM ANOTHER ASPECT, DDO-R ENJOYS ALL THE PREVILIGES OF AC AND AVOIDS ALL THE TENSIONS OF LAW AND ORDER WHICH AC HAD 2 FACE.
8. ALL THE DEPTT R WORKING UNDER DMG OFFICERS. I GIVE A SMALL EXAMPLE, OFFICERS OF ALL THE GROUPS FACE MUCH DIFFICULTY IN RE EMBURSEMENT OF MEDICAL BILLS, BUT IT IS NOT AN ISSUE 4 DMG OFFICERS. THE SAME HAPPENS WITH ALL OTHER MATTERS
9. EVEN POLICE ALSO COMES UNDER THEIR PERVIEW AS THEY R PRESENT IN HOME DEPTT. U KNOW if a DPO thinks that his ACR is wrongly filled by DIG, he ll have 2 request addl. secretary home- a DMG officer (not 2 IG).
10.. I M AMAZED 2 SEE THAT PPL CONSIDER DMG AS DDO-R ship ONLY. NO DEAR, DMG IS MUCH MORE THAN ONLY DDO-R. IT IS THE FIRST STEP ONLY.
11. EVEN IF THE OLD MAGISTRACY DOES NOT COME BACK( WHICH IS ALSO NOT SUPPOSED 2 COME BACK), DMG WILL CONTINUE 2 SHINE AS A STAR, coz whenever there is a vaccume, it is filled by DMG

@ zain
u wrote that
As for as DCO is concerned It takes fifteen years to reach there. and now keeping in view the provincial autonomy more and more officers from provincial management are being appointed on this post, particularly in Punjab
PERHAPS U DONT KNOW THAT THIS IDEA HAS BEEN DROPPED 2 APPOINT MORE DCOs FROM PROVINCIAL SERVICES. U R ALSO UNAWARE OF PRESENT STATISTICS OF PUNJAB.
OUT OF 35 DCOs, ONLY 3 DCOs BELONG 2 PROVINCIAL SERVICES AND ALL OF THEM R ON CONTRACT AFTER RETIREMENT. SO, NOT EVEN A SINGLE IN SERVICE DCO OF PCS.
comparison b/w DDO-r and AC income tax ( the joke of the day)
dear i donot say anything in this regard except that if there is given a chance 2 exchange groups, all the tax group ( except girls) will go 2 DMG and NOT EVEN A SINGLE DMG OFFICER WILL JOIN TAX....... ASK UR HEART HONESTLY.
(LET S B HONEST). WHAT ELSE I CAN SAY
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  #29  
Old Sunday, October 21, 2007
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Correction for point no. 9

DPO's reporting officer is DIG/RPO while the counter signing officer is IG. Home Secretary has no role. IG is the ex officio secretary of police department. Plus, he is a commander of force. Mostly IG's are way senior to the HS. Moreover, in most of the provinces the IGs are senior to the Chief Secretaries in service. Punjab's IG is from 1st ctp while CS is from 2nd ctp. Sindh IG is 1970 batch while CS is 1972 batch. What i intend to elaborate is that Police is not subserviant to home department.
The bottom line is that both services PSP and DMG have its pro and cons. Officers of both service command a lot of respect in the society and they are two of the most important services of the civil bureaucracy.
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  #30  
Old Sunday, October 21, 2007
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@ ihs
you are welcome Imran bhai. And thnx for the detailed post enlighting and describing the future trends, aspects & prospects of career profile of DMG officers after devolution. So I've got the fact that why DMG is on the top priority either one or two number of candidates coming on top of the merit by going through your post.

regards,
sincerely.
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