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  #11  
Old Sunday, March 01, 2015
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English is very very important especially in this new globalised world. Citizens of countries who are not good in English are suffering a lot and they wish they had good english education. It is the most known and used international language that breaks many barriers. I've lived in an international student environment and I have experienced this first hand. With the passage of time, the importance of English and Science is increasing tremendously, we cannot stay behind in an extremely fast and competitive world, I am reminded of Sir Syed Ahmad Khan now..
Yes, you are quite right. China has attained heights of advancement in technology just because it espoused English language many a years ago. Modi had conversed with Barack Obama and CNN in English and this is why he is famous in USA. Russia's military could not have managed to build the aircrafts, warships and advanced jet engines (that no other country can build) had it not adopted the English language. South Korea owes its nuclear arsenal to English language. And the list of achievements of English language never ends.

A country cannot adopt English language in its competitive exams just because a handful of students go abroad and study in English. Secondly, if English is crucial for national survival, then why do urdu medium schools exist? Just abolish them. Learn to respect your national language. It should be a compulsory subject for all exams that reap entry into bureaucratic framework. English essay and grammar should also be compulsory subjects due to their importance. However, at least Islamiat and Pakistan Affairs should be dominated in urdu language.


It is sheer injustice with the poor section of the society to expect them to be pro at English language when at the same time the public school system is flooded with urdu dominated text books. There should be some form of relief for them in a couple of papers where they might be able to attain some competetive edge over other candidates.
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Originally Posted by kingfalcon View Post
English is very very important especially in this new globalised world. Citizens of countries who are not good in English are suffering a lot and they wish they had good english education. It is the most known and used international language that breaks many barriers. I've lived in an international student environment and I have experienced this first hand. With the passage of time, the importance of English and Science is increasing tremendously, we cannot stay behind in an extremely fast and competitive world, I am reminded of Sir Syed Ahmad Khan now..
Where did you studied from?
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Old Sunday, March 01, 2015
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It's very wonerful expreience for me although my papers are not satisfactory and i am decided to go for next attempt but i learnt alot from this
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Old Sunday, March 01, 2015
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Yes, you are quite right. China has attained heights of advancement in technology just because it espoused English language many a years ago. Modi had conversed with Barack Obama and CNN in English and this is why he is famous in USA. Russia's military could not have managed to build the aircrafts, warships and advanced jet engines (that no other country can build) had it not adopted the English language. South Korea owes its nuclear arsenal to English language. And the list of achievements of English language never ends.

A country cannot adopt English language in its competitive exams just because a handful of students go abroad and study in English. Secondly, if English is crucial for national survival, then why do urdu medium schools exist? Just abolish them. Learn to respect your national language. It should be a compulsory subject for all exams that reap entry into bureaucratic framework. English essay and grammar should also be compulsory subjects due to their importance. However, at least Islamiat and Pakistan Affairs should be dominated in urdu language.


It is sheer injustice with the poor section of the society to expect them to be pro at English language when at the same time the public school system is flooded with urdu dominated text books. There should be some form of relief for them in a couple of papers where they might be able to attain some competetive edge over other candidates.

haha you sound a bit funny.. Unfortunately most of the people in our country are too deluded and disconnected from the realities of the world. Do you know that China owes its success due to the english speaking west? (Yes, most of Europeans and Americans know english very well and whenever they have to communicate between themselves or with the outside world, they use english). The Chinese and Westerners communicate in English not Chinese. The whole knowledge and design of various things is in English not Chinese. By the way, China is good in production, not design and technology, the designing and research is still dominated by the West. The internet and leading research is in english not chinese or urdu. Whenever you meet a foreign person, even an Arab, you talk to him in English because you cannot speak Arabic and he cannot speak Urdu but both of you know English. All the media and book publishing is dominated by english. Just because Russia has good rocket/jet engines doesn't mean it is because they did not adopt english, why can't they make the best cars or computers in the world if they are so good in "rocket science"? Does South Korea have nukes? I don't think so, and if you meant North, then you should know very well how they made them (if they even have them in the first place).

Who is saying that a country should adopt english just because a handful of students go abroad and study in english.. You should be happy that some students go abroad and study in english to get valuable knowledge and skills that can be helpful for our country. In fact I want our government to send as many students as possible so that they learn about the world and broaden their horizons. We should be happy that english is part of our competitive exams since it is a very important language and enables us to be global citizens with access to the world, we don't need to confine ourselves. When you are in an international environment, english allows you to speak with almost any person whether from Japan, China, Russia, Germany or any other place. There is no need for Urdu Adab, just simple urdu exam is enough. Why should Islamiat and Pak Affairs be "dominated" in Urdu? I don't see the point, it is better to give an option to the student if he/she wants to give it in Urdu or English. In fact only urdu should be in urdu, why is there a need to have Pak Affairs and Islamiat in urdu??

Yes, I completely agree with you that poor people are being treated unequally by urdu medium education and then demanding english based proficiency from them. This is what I am shouting about, good quality english and science should be taught to every student in this country along with other subjects. We need to teach english to students in urdu medium schools instead of changing the whole system into an urdu based one, that would be a disaster for our progress. Tomorrow you will have people struggling to learn english and unable to compete or communicate with the rest of the world nor could they use the internet effectively or understand all the latest research.
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Where did you studied from?
UK brother..
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingfalcon View Post
haha you sound a bit funny.. Unfortunately most of the people in our country are too deluded and disconnected from the realities of the world. Do you know that China owes its success due to the english speaking west? (Yes, most of Europeans and Americans know english very well and whenever they have to communicate between themselves or with the outside world, they use english). The Chinese and Westerners communicate in English not Chinese. The whole knowledge and design of various things is in English not Chinese. By the way, China is good in production, not design and technology, the designing and research is still dominated by the West. The internet and leading research is in english not chinese or urdu. Whenever you meet a foreign person, even an Arab, you talk to him in English because you cannot speak Arabic and he cannot speak Urdu but both of you know English. All the media and book publishing is dominated by english. Just because Russia has good rocket/jet engines doesn't mean it is because they did not adopt english, why can't they make the best cars or computers in the world if they are so good in "rocket science"? Does South Korea have nukes? I don't think so, and if you meant North, then you should know very well how they made them (if they even have them in the first place).

Who is saying that a country should adopt english just because a handful of students go abroad and study in english.. You should be happy that some students go abroad and study in english to get valuable knowledge and skills that can be helpful for our country. In fact I want our government to send as many students as possible so that they learn about the world and broaden their horizons. We should be happy that english is part of our competitive exams since it is a very important language and enables us to be global citizens with access to the world, we don't need to confine ourselves. When you are in an international environment, english allows you to speak with almost any person whether from Japan, China, Russia, Germany or any other place. There is no need for Urdu Adab, just simple urdu exam is enough. Why should Islamiat and Pak Affairs be "dominated" in Urdu? I don't see the point, it is better to give an option to the student if he/she wants to give it in Urdu or English. In fact only urdu should be in urdu, why is there a need to have Pak Affairs and Islamiat in urdu??

Yes, I completely agree with you that poor people are being treated unequally by urdu medium education and then demanding english based proficiency from them. This is what I am shouting about, good quality english and science should be taught to every student in this country along with other subjects. We need to teach english to students in urdu medium schools instead of changing the whole system into an urdu based one, that would be a disaster for our progress. Tomorrow you will have people struggling to learn english and unable to compete or communicate with the rest of the world nor could they use the internet effectively or understand all the latest research.
There is a huge difference between learning a language for the sake of advancement (what most countries did) and adopting it altogether. Why do you think Urdu should not be part of Islamiat, Pakistan Affairs papers? It is our national language. Chinese, Russian and North/South Korean ambassadors cannot even speak fluent English. Does this mean their country is doomed? Modi answered entire interview questions to CNN and BBC in Hindi language and he was surely feeling pride in speaking his national language.

And btw, you are not the only one with an international experience. Loads of students go abroad every year. Most of the foreign gradutes just work their way to 'recover' the value of their degree and nothing else. A majority does not even bother to return to this country. Pakistani universities are flooded with competent and talented people. Education in today's world is a business and one can only get it if he/she possesses bank balance.

The need of the hour is to create a balance between our national language and English rather than aligning ourselves to western values (I am not a maulvi). Learning a language for knowledge gathering should be the aim. We should not, as a nation, aim to incubate 'English speaking' generation.

p.s If you are TOO aware of the realities of the world, you are more than welcome to correct the pertinent aspects of this society.
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I suck at Urdu. I even attempted Islamiat in English. But i agree with RoadBlock here.

One, our bureaucracy is supposed to 'serve' a nation 60% of which live for less Rs. 200 a day. How many of these poor do you expect to know English? Does a Bureaucrat require English to serve the nation and the people? definitely not.

Agreed that English is the language of knowledge. Good enough. Lets have English proficient scientists and engineers and doctors but a civil servant does not require English to serve the nation.

Secondly, how much of the above mentioned 60% people do you guess will be able to get an 'English' education? not much i guess. Except for the odd case, those of us who are educated in 'English' come from middle to upper classes. so how do you expect the middle class and upper class to know the problems of the 60%, feel for them and work for them?

I will give my humble suggestion here:

All candidates should have choice to attempt All papers in Urdu or English, except precis and composition. Yes I am saying that there should be choice for essay in English or Urdu too. Essay is meant to convey that an aspirant can present his ideas in a coherent manner. English is not required for that.

And those who do not appear in essay in English should not be allowed to join Foreign Services and we can hide our 'complex' that we are a 'Urdu' speaking nation.

Way to go RoadBlock...
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BTW one of our great problems is 'Sifarish'.

Translate Sifarish into English and then lets see.

Point being that English is neither comprehensive nor advanced enough to understand and convey our core issues...
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I completely agree with brother Kingfalcon. Command over English is indispensable for success in the contemporary world.

China is light years behind the West in research and development.They are only good at manufacturing. They cannot compete with the West in innovation.

All innovations are coming from the West. Does the Orient even have one institution which can match Oxford,Cambridge and ivy league universities of USA?

Trinity College Cambridge alone has more than 32 Nobel laureates.

China,Korea etc can only manufacture goods.They are atleast 50 years behind the West in design and technology.

I dont consider Urdu a rich language at all.It is an amalgam of Persian,Arabic and Turkish.Even our national anthem is almost entirely in Persian.Urdu does not deserve to be given importance at all.We should scrap Urdu totally from our syllabi.
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@ Wheeler

Our problem isn't reaching Mars. Our problem is hunger, poverty, corruption, illiteracy, extremism, terrorism, injustice, prejudices and vested interests.

What innovation you require for these problems?
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