what will we gain by accepting israel? oh, so you people expect economic growth? and you think israel will support you building up your defense? What good have you done to israel that you expect such gratitude from them? Israel has been supporting india in all aspects, it is no more a hidden truth, hmmm, so you think by accepting Israel we can match india now? their supporter will become our supporter as well... wow, is it Israel or a welfare institution? having said that, let me put forth the reasons why it is not acceptable for Muslims/Pakistan to accept Israel: First of all, the issue of Palestinian muslims. Secondly, the issue of masjid al-aqsa. Thirdly, if Pakistan can be threatened by israel that it would attack Pakistan if it went as far as simply testing its nuclear capabilities (which shows Israel's negativity for Pakistan, but no, if we accept israel it will help us build our defense?), I would not agree that today Pakistan go and accept a country which threatened our motherland's security for no good reason.
One more thing, there was a gentleman who mentioned that why have we accepted India if we are not ready to accept Israel. Well, my dear, Pakistan came into existence when India broke up, it would be silly to say that Pakistan does not accept india as a state, as Mount Batton had divided india into India and Pakistan simultaneously so please do not make evasive statements.

Salaam,

Since you've disagreed to my point, I am taking pain to reply you.

First of all brother, you seem to be very belligerent. Pehley kya wrestling kartey thay kya :p.

Now, let me be serious:

India accepted Israel. Today they are friends. India is enjoying the fruits of friendship and peace. In case, Pakistan enjoys the same, you have problems? Why?

Alright... by not accepting Israel, the people of Palestine will get their land back and the Israelities will evacuate the whole country, right? You are underestimating the value of Israel. Try to commemorate the six day war. Even the Arab-Coalition failed to overpower it. Its a real shame, I guess. This world prevails on the principle of might is right and I guess its wisdom to join the powerful. "If you can't beat them, join them". Besides, Israel has already appeared on the map. I don't really think that it can be blotted out so easily.

Israel threatened us. So we want no friendship with it. What do you say about India. It even attacked Pakistan. Still we want peace with it. Will it be stupid of me if I want peace with Israel?

We can have a peace accord and set conditions for Masjid Aqsa issue!

Waiting for your further arguments!

Regards,
Adil Memon

__________________
"The race is not over because I haven't won yet."

Adil Memon
Police Service of Pakistan (P.S.P)
37th Common Training Program

I read all the posting on this topic, so far it seems either people are writing with their emotions or looking at practical situation and realities at present.

Personally, I wouldn't accept Israel. I'm also guilty of using my 'emotions' in this case i guess. For Pakistan to accept Israel, it would put Pakistan up against the interests of all the arab countries and the rest of the Muslim world. Looking at the simple cost and benefit ratio, the cost is simply too high for Pakistan to accept Israel at present without any major benefit for Pakistan. Secondly, by accepting Israel, it would also loosen Pakistan claim for Kashmir.

On the flip side, Israel doesn't have any interest in being recognized by Pakistan. As long as Israel is supported by the West, it will continue to act without respect for the Palestinian lands. Until the day that the issue between the Palestinian people and Israel is not resolved, Pakistan should not recognize Israel..

__________________
[I][FONT=Garamond]The closer one gets to the top, the more one finds there is no "top."[/FONT] [/I]

Cant Dare to reveal the name of that Gentleman huh>! I said that do mention it.
I have my rights,i have my own way of thinking!!!Note it!
And as far as my knowledge goes Mountbatten was the Viceroy and not Mount Batton ,secondly when a country is independent,self autonomous and has her own boundary,government and every thing that it has is with no concern of foreign countries,than it has the RIGHT to Accept or Reject any other country,may it be India or Israel.

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نہ تیرا پاکستان ہے , نہ میرا پاکستان ہے , یہ اس کاپاکستان ہے , جو صدرپاکستان ہے

dude, i couldn't remember the names of the several people who commented but i recalled all the comments while posting my response, so you need not think that i did not want to mention your name, it was just a lapse of memory, i didn't know you love your name being mentioned, next time i'll make sure i mention your name and quote you too, don't worry. about the spelling mistake, my bad, can't comment on that. I know he was the Viceroy but that doesn't concern me as long as the meanings of my msg get conveyed.


Having said that, what I want to say is that even though Pakistan has accepted india which was necessary back then does not mean Pakistan has accepted it as a friend, BHARAT has always been our enemy (and to the last day of my life I would consider BHARAT an enemy of Pakistan even if our present govt. accepts it as a friend) and thats the reason why so much campaigning is being done to accept Bharat as a friend. Now if we accept Israel, it'll obviously be as a friend, not as an enemy. We can't be Israel's friend unless it changes its policies of suppressing its unarmed neighbors. That would put our image at stake in front of the Islamic world which is unacceptable in any case. Its better NOT to accept an enemy as a friend, i know there is a famous saying "keep your friends close and your enemies closer" but they're smarter than us and if we give them a chance, they're not going to be humble enough to be faithful to us. Pakistan supported the Arabs in the 1967 war and caused damage to Israel, Israel never forgives its enemies, which it should not. I admire Israel's courage and its cunning wisdom, but in times such as these, its better to stay back than to act over-smart and get further entangled in the trap that has been setup jointly by the US, BHARAT & ISRAEL for Pakistan. (Not everything works the way we expect it to work... Never underestimate your enemies, even if you are not a threat to a single nation in the world, they consider you as a threat and are hence after your security and your very existence is a thorn in their complacent lives.)

Cool down brother,you just have the habit of referring to me indirectly but anyways i say PEACE <<<White Flag>>
And so,the latest reports are that the General has announced that Pakistan will not accept Israel until it changes its policy about the Palestine issue and evacuate its armed forces.So i think this thread should be closed until Pakistan accepts Israel.

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نہ تیرا پاکستان ہے , نہ میرا پاکستان ہے , یہ اس کاپاکستان ہے , جو صدرپاکستان ہے

@Adil

Ok, so you think that by joining your worst enemies you would become stronger too? Did you know how Mir Jaafar got killed? He joined the Britons and backstabbed his own people so that they would provide him with all their support... You know why the Britons killed him ruthlessly? they said "agar tu apni qaum ka nahi hosakta to hamaaraa kia hoga...", thats exactly what i have stated in my previous response too, by joining them we ease their entrance into our nation and give them a lenient hand to finish us off. India accepted Israel because it knew "the enemies of your enemy are your friends". Also, let me tell you one thing, Pakistan came into existence in the name of Islam and Israel came into existence in the name of Zionism. Even though Pakistan is strangled in its own economic, fuedal, democratic dilemmas, it still poses a threat to Bharat because of its strong military establishment(masha'ALLAH... May ALLAH always keep it second to none). And thats the reason why i am against Pakistan's accepting Israel as a friend and expecting any favors from it. Its just like considering the World Bank our friend because it provides us with trillions of dollars in Loan and in exchange we have to follow its several demands and as a result we have ended up in a quagmire of debts which the Pakistani generations will have to return some day.

Salaam,

I guess the topic is stale now. Here is my last reply in this thread.

@ Shams (mszii):

Brother, I appreciate your ideas. Let me help you recall that Egypt accepted Israel. It was kicked out of the Arab League. However things didn't last long and it re-entered the League unhindered. Why can't the same go on for Pakistan.

I am not sure. But according to my limited knowledge Pakistan was also created on the same pattern as Israel. The jews became a majority so they subsequently created their own land just as the Muslims did. So, if you don't recognize Israel how can you be so proud of our very own country.

Besides... I agree with your last paragraph. You are absolutely right. In reality, Israel doesn't really seem to be compromising.

@ Bushharaf:
Just one question to you, why do you really call the creation of Israel illegal?

Besides... Pakistan has tried to befriend with even its enemies. Including Israel to the list will promote peace rather than insecurity.

Anyways... I guess the discussion is enough now. Lets close the thread.

Thanks to all of you for contributing!

Regards,
Adil Memon

I will soon post a new topic!

__________________
"The race is not over because I haven't won yet."

Adil Memon
Police Service of Pakistan (P.S.P)
37th Common Training Program