Quote:
Originally Posted by Gypsified
I don't think Muslims have any problem with capitalism. In fact, I think they are in love with it. The debaucheries of capitalism in the Arab states (including Mecca itself where they think it's all right to raze historical heritage to ground to make new malls) pretty much make this clear. And among the biggest defenders of Capitalism have been prominent Muslim Ulemas (who are then well fooled by the US).
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Theoretically Islam is not against private property and means of production, however there are certain limits prescribed in Islam ('don't be fooled by world' for example
) as it advocates a much fairer distribution of wealth. Plus there is a list of what is 'hilal' (or allowed) and what is 'haram' (or not allowed) followed by clear and stern warnings in Islam. Now these can only be implemented when there is a strong authoritarian government present, whereas a Democratic government is not one. Therefore even when we have democracy present in a Muslim society and spread of 'haram' is apparently increasing, people vie for 'dictatorship'
. Just a theory
It has also been observed in many scientific studies that, psychologically, during the times of crisis humans look for strong 'male' leadership. Unfortunately I don't have the link but I read it in an article on wikipedia so maybe you can find it. Applying this on Muslims, perhaps they always feel a crisis
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gypsified
And besides, uncontrolled capitalism might be a phase but it hardly lasts long which is because of democracy itself. Civil activism, media and judiciary are the tools to ensure that blind exploitation by the rich is kept under a leash. Some developed countries are already moving forward from capitalist democracies to welfare democracies. France has as much as 70% tax on the rich which is why some of them find it better to just leave the country. The welfare policies of Scandinavian countries with free education and healthcare are another example. Time, again, is the main factor.
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Hmmm well that's true, but it again comes to Muslim conscience. A Muslim 'conscience' is highly warned against civil activism (which is sometimes translated as 'fasad'
) which is why most of the times even a slight difference of opinion from mainstream thought triggers hostile response. Media and Judiciary in Muslim societies, for example Pakistan, sometimes don't play the role as they are expected to in a modern Democracy, ultimately they transgress and start trespassing. Moreover Muslims have this perpetual fear in their 'conscience' and perhaps they feel that only a strong leader can protect 'national interest' in a world where everyone, including 'munafiqun' in their own ranks, is trying to cause harm to it, for example the recent spate between media and agencies in our own beloved country and how the nation responded to it
. This has both religious and historical reasons, religion 'warns' and history of disorders and rebellions in Islamic societies 'back it up' so this fear and paranoia has become a part of genetics perhaps
. A Democratic society on the other hand is apparently a very disorderly one and Muslims, perhaps, don't like the taste of disorder
. Muslims always seem to be looking for a strong, wise and just 'leader' who can ensure progress and justice and maintain order as per the teachings of Islam, not for a democracy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gypsified
I don't think Muslims have any problem with capitalism. In fact, I think they are in love with it. The debaucheries of capitalism in the Arab states (including Mecca itself where they think it's all right to raze historical heritage to ground to make new malls) pretty much make this clear. And among the biggest defenders of Capitalism have been prominent Muslim Ulemas (who are then well fooled by the US).
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Apart from the above I feel what confuses Muslims is another thing, exploitation of poor by rich comes very late but Capitalism poses an immediate threat to established social moral codes. Somehow those well fooled ulemas perhaps feel that this change of morality is because of Democracy so they oppose Democracy instead of the real thing, Capitalism, which remains supported by them
. They are ok with trading with the infidel, they are ok with having personal relationships with the infidels, but when it comes to their own people demanding any rights there is a biggest fitna and immorality spreading in Muslims
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mhmmdkashif
Apart from the above I feel what confuses Muslims is another thing, exploitation of poor by rich comes very late but Capitalism poses an immediate threat to established social moral codes. Somehow those well fooled ulemas perhaps feel that this change of morality is because of Democracy so they oppose Democracy instead of the real thing, Capitalism, which remains supported by them . They are ok with trading with the infidel, they are ok with having personal relationships with the infidels, but when it comes to their own people demanding any rights there is a biggest fitna and immorality spreading in Muslims .
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As a result Saudis are using other 'Muslims' as slaves. You have widespread corruption, prostitution, smuggling, wine drinking, almost everything considered a vice in Islam including murder and yet no one is ready to speak about it, there is no check and balance on powers. These ulemas really are to be blamed for many things
, we have almost reached times like about which Prophet (SAW) warned 'when drinking will be considered halal'.