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  #21  
Old Wednesday, July 31, 2013
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I think PPP shouldn't boycott this election as this party is the biggest oppostion party but it seems like new party in which there is no poltical maturity. Secondly it's candidate (raza rabbani) is stronger one and can get maximum seats from Sindh assembly,at least ppp should fight... PTI also contest this election although being aware of court's biased verdict but participated in democratic process which reflects its political maturity ....
I read news about CEC that he consider to resign from his post because he's so disappointed by the weakness of the members in front of court's verdict and also discourage by the political parties regarding general election's rigging, why in our system honest man can't survive or probably he is not stronger enough to challenge court's decision....Independent court for which almost all political parties unite so it's that court for which we struggle to make it independent awwwhhhh so sad
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Old Wednesday, July 31, 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilal Hassan View Post
Indeed, i second your opinion. BUT the real implication arises out of antecedents of their boycott. The PPP was no way in a position to win that election, the overwhelming majority of PML (N) in center and Punjab gave them many electoral votes and not to overlook the factor that Punjab Assembly has more members than any other provincial assembly, and clear majority of PML N in Punjab was an edge. PPP realized the writing on the wall and it considered the discretion as better art of valor, boycotted the elections.

Definitely they form a considerable representation of Sindh but if they boycott the election just because they can't win it, then this is really a bad precedent they are establishing. What they are doing is against the siprit of the Democracy.



Yes brother i think they must have waited for some time, at least it would not give excuse to other parties to boycott the election, but here SC is more expeditious then the Govt. BUT if they had waited, still PML N was going to win it..... No brother, if you term Mamnnon Hussain as controversial then you are not being neutral, for other parties he might be controversial, bbut he has been elected by our representatives by majority, which in turn have been elected by us. Calling him controversial might be just for other parties but we have given mandate to PML (N), have respect for that.
You are right brother that PPP was in now position to win the election but so was PTI, still it opted for contesting elections. I dont think the reason for boycotting was that it would'nt win. THe reason was to protest against the biased decision of SC and overlooking of all the constitutional hurdles involved in the matter. I believe PPP is quite justified in its decision.
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  #23  
Old Thursday, August 01, 2013
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Originally Posted by sabahatbhutta View Post
There are certainly future implications. As I stated in my previous post and you seconded my opinion. In political history boycotting an electoral process means a lot. It is a way of recording one's protest and grievances in a democratic manner.
Losing and boycotting doesn't mean the same. you are a student of political science and you know this. Boycotting simply means distrust while loosing means one had trust on the credibility and fairness of the electoral process.
The resignation of fakhroo Bhaee clearly manifests the election was controversial. Its not about who was to win everybody knew PML N would win as they have majority. The point is if PML N's success was so obvious then why did they rush to SC to change the date of election? The reason presented by them is baseless. If 100 members were to be absent owing to Umra and Aitkaf then election could have been conduct after Eid, why such rush?
I agree PPP should strengthen democracy. But I am sorry to say democracy can not be strengthened by SC's overshadowing ECP.
Quite impressive. How can we improve our knowledge of Pakistani politics?
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  #24  
Old Thursday, August 01, 2013
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Originally Posted by Ahsan Ali Shaikh View Post
Quite impressive. How can we improve our knowledge of Pakistani politics?
Study good books on politics. Try to understand the essence of political activities and then analyse. And the most important thing do not rush behind the media they mostly present false and tampered views.
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  #25  
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Originally Posted by sabahatbhutta View Post
Study good books on politics. Try to understand the essence of political activities and then analyse. And the most important thing do not rush behind the media they mostly present false and tampered views.
In order to understand politics, its better to go through some good books first. Would you mention a couple of good books in this regard?
  #26  
Old Thursday, August 01, 2013
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Originally Posted by Ahsan Ali Shaikh View Post
In order to understand politics, its better to go through some good books first. Would you mention a couple of good books in this regard?
Brother i don't think politics is a thing worth learning or studying, It is just an ordinary thing, the people at the tea shops are discussing Pakistani Politics..Not everything is worth learning, one must be perspicacious to know what is worth learning and what is not...It will help you neither in your CSS exam nor in anything else..If you want to make a good understanding of Politics then your nearest Tea shop or "Chaye ka Hotel" is the best place to make your understanding of politics better.

However, if you want to understand "Political Science" then i can recommend you following good books.
  • History of Philosophy by Fredrick Copleston (Rome and Greece), it will help you to go to the beginning of Political Philosophy from the time of Plato and Greek city states, first democracies of the world)
  • Western Political Thought by Judd Harmon
  • Muslim Political Thought by Rosenthal
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  #27  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilal Hassan View Post
Brother i don't think politics is a thing worth learning or studying, It is just an ordinary thing, the people at the tea shops are discussing Pakistani Politics..Not everything is worth learning, one must be perspicacious to know what is worth learning and what is not...It will help you neither in your CSS exam nor in anything else..If you want to make a good understanding of Politics then your nearest Tea shop or "Chaye ka Hotel" is the best place to make your understanding of politics better.

However, if you want to understand "Political Science" then i can recommend you following good books.
  • History of Philosophy by Fredrick Copleston (Rome and Greece), it will help you to go to the beginning of Political Philosophy from the time of Plato and Greek city states, first democracies of the world)
  • Western Political Thought by Judd Harmon
  • Muslim Political Thought by Rosenthal

You are right and in the case of Pakistani politics it is more easy to study because we Pakistanis don't have any thing to do only we have time to discuss things that is nothing to do with it. Also in Pakistani context every one have their own definition for Politics and democracy. Here it is Zordari democracy,Mian's democracy and many many forms of politics and democracy prevailing in our society.
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  #28  
Old Thursday, August 01, 2013
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Originally Posted by Bilal Hassan View Post
Brother i don't think politics is a thing worth learning or studying, It is just an ordinary thing, the people at the tea shops are discussing Pakistani Politics..Not everything is worth learning, one must be perspicacious to know what is worth learning and what is not...It will help you neither in your CSS exam nor in anything else..If you want to make a good understanding of Politics then your nearest Tea shop or "Chaye ka Hotel" is the best place to make your understanding of politics better.

However, if you want to understand "Political Science" then i can recommend you following good books.
  • History of Philosophy by Fredrick Copleston (Rome and Greece), it will help you to go to the beginning of Political Philosophy from the time of Plato and Greek city states, first democracies of the world)
  • Western Political Thought by Judd Harmon
  • Muslim Political Thought by Rosenthal
Politics has its worth that is why as you said it is being discussed in tea shops even. Learning is never worthless.
Books mentioned by you are very good. I want to suggest one comprehensive book covering all these sections mentioned by you. Its Political Science by Imtiaz Shahid. It is very useful for CSS and PMS prep as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tajmeer View Post
You are right and in the case of Pakistani politics it is more easy to study because we Pakistanis don't have any thing to do only we have time to discuss things that is nothing to do with it. Also in Pakistani context every one have their own definition for Politics and democracy. Here it is Zordari democracy,Mian's democracy and many many forms of politics and democracy prevailing in our society.
It has now become a fashion to condemn and criticise each and every aspect of Pakistani politics. Brother duniya ka koi kona bhee cchaan marain apko politics taqreeban Pakistani politics se milti julti hee mily gee.
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  #29  
Old Thursday, August 01, 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sabahatbhutta View Post
Politics has its worth that is why as you said it is being discussed in tea shops even. Learning is never worthless.
Books mentioned by you are very good. I want to suggest one comprehensive book covering all these sections mentioned by you. Its Political Science by Imtiaz Shahid. It is very useful for CSS and PMS prep as well.




It has now become a fashion to condemn and criticise each and every aspect of Pakistani politics. Brother duniya ka koi kona bhee cchaan marain apko politics taqreeban Pakistani politics se milti julti hee mily gee.
Yes you are right up to some extent that now a day democracy is not prevail in its real sense but in other countries political parties have some ethical and moral value through which they select their leaders but what is here only bargaining in the drying rooms of Politicians. Every decision take place behind the secret walls not in from of the nation.
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  #30  
Old Thursday, August 01, 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sabahatbhutta View Post
Politics has its worth that is why as you said it is being discussed in tea shops even. Learning is never worthless.
Books mentioned by you are very good. I want to suggest one comprehensive book covering all these sections mentioned by you. Its Political Science by Imtiaz Shahid. It is very useful for CSS and PMS prep as well.




It has now become a fashion to condemn and criticise each and every aspect of Pakistani politics. Brother duniya ka koi kona bhee cchaan marain apko politics taqreeban Pakistani politics se milti julti hee mily gee.
Aray Sister look, The value of a thing is calculated on the basis of the people who discuss it and the place where it is discussed, and further inferences are made, only those discuss a thing who are capable to discuss it, and those who have that capability tell us whether this is thing is valuable at all or not.

Now i make you understand in the light of above sketch.....

__________________________________________________ _______________

The people who sit at tea shops are roughly labourers, drivers etc.
Those who sit at tea shops dicuss politics.


So politics is discussed by the labourers and Drivers.

The Drivers and labourers are uneducated mostly.
Those who are uneducated will discuss things that they can discuss.

So Politics is discussed by Drivers and Labourers because they can discuss it.

The thing discussed by uneducated people will be non important because without education you can't discuss something valuable.

So Politics is a non important thing.
__________________________________________________ _______________

Plato never discussed what Philip of Macedonia or Chareldon of Ionia does, though he discussed what should be the best constitution one may have, he discusssed what was important, never what they are doing. Contemporary Politics is not a thing worth studying as it never has been.

Sister i have aversion for such books as you have told, Imtiaz Shahid has written books on every subject almost, from EDS to Pol science and from English to Journalism. Because he writes no book at all, he just copies the material, then why not go to original source? And originality makes you learn the knowledge in a real way.
And yes you are right, Politics is a dirty thing, terribly messy. And what is bad, is bad, irrespective of where it is.
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