excerpt from Quaid-i-Azam's Speech
On the occasion of the Opening Ceremony of
The State Bank of Pakistan on 1st July, 1948.

I shall watch with keenness the work of your Research Organization in evolving banking practices compatible with Islamic ideas of social and economic life. The economic system of the West has created almost insoluble problems for humanity and to many of us it appears that only a miracle can save it from disaster that is not facing the world. It has failed to do justice between man and man and to eradicate friction from the international field. On the contrary, it was largely responsible for the two world wars in the last half century. The Western world, in spite of its advantages, of mechanization and industrial efficiency is today in a worse mess than ever before in history. The adoption of Western economic theory and practice will not help us in achieving our goal of creating a happy and contended people. We must work our destiny in our own way and present to the world an economic system based on true Islamic concept of equality of manhood and social justice. We will thereby be fulfilling our mission as Muslims and giving to humanity the message of peace which alone can save it and secure the welfare, happiness and prosperity of mankind.

think about what he said. there is no "Quaid said secularism" or "Quaid said Islamic State" here. so think about what he said.

http://www.sbp.org.pk/about/history/h_moments.htm

and then you can have your secular state

The Streets of Ashkelon

by Harry Harrison

Published September 2012 | 6358 words
© 1962 Harry Harrison

Somewhere above, hidden by the eternal clouds of Wesker’s World, a thunder rumbled and grew. Trader Garth stopped suddenly when he heard it, his boots sinking slowly into the muck, and cupped his good ear to catch the sound. It swelled and waned in the thick atmosphere, growing louder.

“That noise is the same as the noise of your sky-ship,” Itin said, with stolid Wesker logicality, slowly pulverizing the idea in his mind and turning over the bits one by one for closer examination. “But your ship is still sitting where you landed it. It must be, even though we cannot see it, because you are the only one who can operate it. And even if anyone else could operate it we would have heard it rising into the sky. Since we did not, and if this sound is a sky-ship sound, then it must mean—”

“Yes, another ship,” Garth said, too absorbed in his own thoughts to wait for the laborious Weskerian chains of logic to clank their way through to the end. Of course it was another spacer, it had been only a matter of time before one appeared, and undoubtedly this one was homing on the S.S radar reflector as he had done. His own ship would show up clearly on the newcomer’s screen and they would probably set down as close to it as they could.

“You better go ahead, Itin,” he said. “Use the water so you can get to the village quickly. Tell everyone to get back into the swamps, well clear of the hard ground. That ship is landing on instruments and anyone underneath at touchdown is going to be cooked.”

This immediate threat was clear enough to the little Wesker am*phibian. Before Garth had finished speaking Itin’s ribbed ears had folded like a bat’s wings and he slipped silently into the nearby ca*nal. Garth squelched on through the mud, making as good time as he could over the clinging surface. He had just reached the fringes of the village clearing when the rumbling grew to a head-splitting roar and the spacer broke through the low-hanging layer of clouds above. Garth shielded his eyes from the down-reaching tongue of flame and examined the growing form of the gray-black ship with mixed feelings.

After almost a standard year on Wesker’s World he had to fight down a longing for human companionship of any kind. While this buried fragment of herd-spirit chattered for the rest of the monkey tribe, his trader’s mind was busily drawing a line under a column of figures and adding up the total. This could very well be another trader’s ship, and if it was his monopoly of the Wesker’s trade was at an end. Then again, this might not be a trader at all, which was the reason he stayed in the shelter of the giant fern and loosened his gun in its holster. The ship baked dry a hundred square meters of mud, the roaring blast died, and the landing feet crunched down through the crackling crust. Metal creaked and settled into place while the cloud of smoke and steam slowly drifted lower in the humid air.

“Garth—you native-cheating extortionist—where are you?” the ship’s speaker boomed. The lines of the spacer had looked only slightly familiar, but there was no mistaking the rasping tones of that voice. Garth had a twisted smile when he stepped out into the open and whistled shrilly through two fingers. A directional microphone ground out of its casing on the ship’s fin and turned in his direction.

“What are you doing here, Singh?” he shouted towards the mike. “Too crooked to find a planet of your own and have to come here to steal an honest trader’s profits?”

“Honest!” the amplified voice roared. “This from the man who has been in more jails than cathouses—and that a goodly number in itself, I do declare. Sorry, friend of my youth, but I cannot join you in ex*ploiting this aboriginal pesthole. I am on course to a more fairly at*mosphered world where a fortune is waiting to be made. I only stopped here since an opportunity presented, to turn an honest credit by running a taxi service. I bring you friendship, the perfect compan*ionship, a man in a different line of business who might help you in yours. I’d come out and say hello myself, except I would have to decon for biologicals. I’m cycling the passenger through the lock so I hope you won’t mind helping with his luggage.”

At least there would be no other trader on the planet now, that worry was gone. But Garth still wondered what sort of passenger would be taking one-way passage to an undeveloped world. And what was behind that concealed hint of merriment in Singh’s voice? He walked around to the far side of the spacer where the ramp had dropped, and looked up at the man in the cargo lock who was wres*tling ineffectually with a large crate. The man turned towards him and Garth saw the clerical dog-collar and knew just what it was Singh had been chuckling about.

“What are you doing here?” Garth asked, and in spite of his at*tempt at self-control he snapped the words. If the man noticed this he ignored it, because he was still smiling and putting out his hand as he came down the ramp.

“Father Mark,” he said, “of the Missionary Society of Brothers. I’m very pleased to meet—”

“I said what are you doing here.” Garth’s voice was under control now, quiet and cold. He knew what had to be done, and it must be done quickly or not at all.

“That should be obvious,” Father Mark said, his good nature still unruffled. “Our missionary society has raised funds to send spiritual emissaries to alien worlds for the first time. I was lucky enough—”

“Take your luggage and get back into the ship. You’re not wanted here—and have no permission to land. You’ll be a liability and there is no one on Wesker’s World to take care of you. Get back into the ship.”

“I don’t know who you are sir, or why you are lying to me,” the priest said. He was still calm but the smile was gone. “But I have studied galactic law and the history of this planet very well. There are no diseases or beasts here that I should have any particular fear of. It is also an open planet, and until the Space Survey changes that status I have as much right to be here as you do.”

The man was of course right, but Garth couldn’t let him know that. He had been bluffing, hoping the priest didn’t know his rights. But he did. There was only one distasteful course left for him, and he had better do it while there was still time.

“Get back in that ship,” he shouted, not hiding his anger now. With a smooth motion his gun was out of the holster and the pitted black muzzle only inches from the priest’s stomach. The man’s face turned white, but he did not move.

“What the hell are you doing, Garth?!” Singh’s shocked voice grated from the speaker. “The guy paid his fare and you have no rights at all to throw him off the planet.”

“I have this right,” Garth said, raising his gun and sighting between the priest’s eyes. “I give him thirty seconds to get back aboard the ship or I pull the trigger.”

“Well, I think you are either off your head or playing a joke,” Singh’s exasperated voice rasped down at them. “If it is a joke, it is in bad taste. But either way you’re not getting away with it. Two can play at that game—only I can play it better.”

There was the rumble of heavy bearings and the remote-controlled four-gun turret on the ship’s side rotated and pointed at Garth. “Now—down gun and give Father Mark a hand with the luggage,” the speaker commanded, a trace of humor back in the voice now. “As much as I would like to help, Old Friend, I cannot. I feel it is time you had a chance to talk to the father; after all, I have had the op*portunity of speaking with him all the way from Earth.”

Garth jammed the gun back into the holster with an acute feeling of loss. Father Mark stepped forward, the winning smile back now and a Bible, taken from a pocket of his robe, in his raised hand. “My son—” he said.

“I’m not your son,” was all Garth could choke out as the bitterness and defeat welled up within him. His fist drew back as the anger rose, and the best he could do was open the fist so he struck only with the flat of his hand. Still the blow sent the priest crashing to the ground and hurled the white pages of the book splattering into the thick mud.

Itin and the other Weskers had watched everything with seemingly emotionless interest. Garth made no attempt to answer their unspo*ken questions. He started towards his house, but turned back when he saw they were still unmoving.

“A new man has come,” he told them. “He will need help with the things he has brought. If he doesn’t have any place for them, you can put them in the big warehouse until he has a place of his own.”

He watched them waddle across the clearing towards the ship, then went inside and gained a certain satisfaction from slamming the door hard enough to crack one of the panes. There was an equal amount of painful pleasure in breaking out one of the remaining bottles of Irish whiskey that he had been saving for a special occasion. Well this was special enough, though not really what he had had in mind. The whiskey was good and burned away some of the bad taste in his mouth, but not all of it. If his tactics had worked, success would have justified everything. But he had failed and in addition to the pain of failure there was the acute feeling that he had made a horse’s ass out of himself. Singh had blasted off without any goodbyes. There was no telling what sense he had made of the whole matter, though he would surely carry some strange stories back to the trader’s lodge. Well, that could be worried about the next time Garth signed in. Right now he had to go about setting things right with the mission*ary. Squinting out through the rain he saw the man struggling to erect a collapsible tent while the entire population of the village stood in ordered ranks and watched. Naturally none of them offered to help.

By the time the tent was up and the crates and boxes stowed inside it the rain had stopped. The level of fluid in the bottle was a good bit lower and Garth felt more like facing up to the unavoidable meeting. In truth, he was looking forward to talking to the man. This whole nasty business aside, after an entire solitary year any human com*panionship looked good. Will you join me now for dinner? John Garth, he wrote on the back of an old invoice. But maybe the guy was too frightened to come? Which was no way to start any kind of relationship. Rummaging under the bunk, he found a box that was big enough and put his pistol inside. Itin was of course waiting out*side the door when he opened it, since this was his tour as Knowledge Collector. He handed him the note and box.

“Would you take these to the new man,” he said.

“Is the new man’s name New Man?” Itin asked.

“No, it’s not!” Garth snapped. “His name is Mark. But I’m only asking you to deliver this, not get involved in conversation.”

As always when he lost his temper, the literal-minded Weskers won the round. “You are not asking for conversation,” Itin said slowly, “but Mark may ask for conversation. And others will ask me his name; if I do not know his na—”

The voice cut off as Garth slammed the door. This didn’t work in the long run either because next time he saw Itin—a day, a week, or even a month later—the monologue would be picked up on the very word it had ended and the thought rambled out to its last frayed end. Garth cursed under his breath and poured water over a pair of the tastier concentrates that he had left.

“Come in,” he said when there was a quiet knock on the door. The priest entered and held out the box with the gun.

“Thank you for the loan, Mr. Garth, I appreciate the spirit that made you send it. I have no idea of what caused the unhappy affair when I landed, but I think it would be best forgotten if we are going to be on this planet together for any length of time.”

“Drink?” Garth asked, taking the box and pointing to the bottle on the table. He poured two glasses full and handed one to the priest. “That’s about what I had in mind, but I still owe you an explanation of what happened out there.” He scowled into his glass for a second, then raised it to the other man. “It’s a big universe and I guess we have to make out as best we can. Here’s to Sanity.”

“God be with you,” Father Mark said, and raised his glass as well. “Not with me or with this planet,” Garth said firmly. “And that’s the crux of the matter.” He half-drained the glass and sighed.

“Do you say that to shock me?” the priest asked with a smile. “I assure you that it doesn’t.”

“Not intended to shock. I meant it quite literally. I suppose I’m what you would call an atheist, so revealed religion is no concern of mine. While these natives, simple and unlettered Stone Age types that they are, have managed to come this far with no superstitions or traces of deism whatsoever. I had hoped that they might continue that way.”

“What are you saying?” The priest frowned. “Do you mean they have no gods, no belief in the hereafter? They must die . . . ?”

“Die they do, and to dust returneth. Like the rest of the animals. They have thunder, trees, and water without having thunder-gods, tree sprites, or water nymphs. They have no ugly little gods, taboos, or spells to hag-ride and limit their lives. They are the only primitive people I have ever encountered that are completely free of supersti*tion and appear to be much happier and sane because of it. I just wanted to keep them that way.”

“You wanted to keep them from God—from salvation?” The priest’s eyes widened and he recoiled slightly.

“No,” Garth said. “I wanted to keep them from superstition until they knew more and could think about it realistically without being absorbed and perhaps destroyed by it.”

“You’re being insulting to the Church, sir, to equate it with su*perstition . . .”

“Please,” Garth said, raising his hand. “No theological arguments. I don’t think your society footed the bill for this trip just to attempt to convert me. Just accept the fact that my beliefs have been arrived at through careful thought over a period of years, and no amount of undergraduate metaphysics will change them. I’ll promise not to try and convert you—if you will do the same for me.”

“Agreed, Mr. Garth. As you have reminded me, my mission here is to save these souls, and that is what I must do. But why should my work disturb you so much that you try and keep me from landing? Even threaten me with your gun, and—” The priest broke off and looked into his glass.

“And even slug you?” Garth asked, suddenly frowning. “There was no excuse for that, and I would like to say that I’m sorry. Plain bad manners and an even worse temper. Live alone long enough and you find yourself doing that kind of thing.” He brooded down at his big hands where they lay on the table, reading memories into the scars and calluses patterned there. “Let’s just call it frustration, for lack of a better word. In your business you must have had a lot of chances to peep into the darker places in men’s minds and you should know a bit about motives and happiness. I have had too busy a life to ever consider settling down and raising a family, and right up until re*cently I never missed it. Maybe leakage radiation is softening up my brain, but I had begun to think of these furry and fishy Weskers as being a little like my own children, that I was somehow responsible to them.”

“We are all His children,” Father Mark said quietly.

“Well, here are some of His children that can’t even imagine His existence,” Garth said, suddenly angry at himself for allowing gentler emotions to show through. Yet he forgot himself at once, leaning forward with the intensity of his feelings. “Can’t you realize the im*portance of this? Live with these Weskers a while and you will dis*cover a simple and happy life that matches the state of grace you people are always talking about. They get pleasure from their lives—and cause no one pain. By circumstances they have evolved on an almost barren world, so have never had a chance to grow out of a physical Stone Age culture. But mentally they are our match—or per*haps better. They have all learned my language so I can easily explain the many things they want to know. Knowledge and the gaining of knowledge gives them real satisfaction. They tend to be exasperating at times because every new fact must be related to the structure of all other things, but the more they learn the faster this process be*comes. Someday they are going to be man’s equal in every way, per*haps surpass us. If—would you do me a favor?”

“Whatever I can.”

“Leave them alone. Or teach them if you must—history and sci*ence, philosophy, law, anything that will help them face the realities of the greater universe they never even knew existed before. But don’t confuse them with your hatreds and pain, guilt, sin, and punishment. Who knows the harm—”

“You are being insulting, sir!” the priest said, jumping to his feet. The top of his grey head barely came to the massive spaceman’s chin, yet he showed no fear in defending what he believed. Garth, standing now himself, was no longer the penitent. They faced each other in anger, as men have always stood, unbending in the defense of that which they think right.

“Yours is the insult,” Garth shouted. “The incredible egotism to feel that your derivative little mythology, differing only slightly from the thousands of others that still burden men, can do anything but confuse their still fresh minds. Don’t you realize that they believe in truth—and have never heard of such a thing as a lie? They have not been trained yet to understand that other kinds of minds can think differently from theirs. Will you spare them this . . . ?”

“I will do my duty which is His will, Mr. Garth. These are God’s creatures here, and they have souls. I cannot shirk my duty, which is to bring them His word so that they may be saved and enter into the Kingdom of Heaven.”

When the priest opened the door the wind caught it and blew it wide. He vanished into the storm-swept darkness and the door swung back and forth and a splatter of raindrops blew in. Garth’s boots left muddy footprints when he closed the door, shutting out the sight of Itin sitting patiently and uncomplaining in the storm, hoping only that Garth might stop for a moment and leave with him some of the wonderful knowledge of which he had so much.

By unspoken consent that first night was never mentioned again. After a few days of loneliness, made worse because each knew of the other’s proximity, they found themselves talking on carefully neutral grounds. Garth slowly packed and stowed away his stock and never admitted that his work was finished and he could leave at any time. He had a fair amount of interesting drugs and botanicals that would fetch a good price. And the Wesker artifacts were sure to create a sensation in the sophisticated galactic market. Crafts on the planet here had been limited before his arrival, mostly pieces of carving painfully chipped into the hard wood with fragments of stone. He had supplied tools and a stock of raw metal from his own supplies, noth*ing more than that. In a few months the Weskers had not only learned to work with the new materials, but had translated their own designs and forms into the most alien—but most beautiful—artifacts that he had ever seen. All he had to do was release these on the market to create a primary demand, then return for a new supply. The Weskers wanted only books and tools and knowledge in return, and through their own efforts he knew they would pull themselves into the ga*lactic union.

This is what Garth had hoped. But a wind of change was blowing through the settlement that had grown up around his ship. No longer was he the center of attention and focal point of the village life. He had to grin when he thought of his fall from power; yet there was very little humor in the smile. Serious and attentive Weskers still took turns of duty as Knowledge Collectors, but their recording of dry facts was in sharp contrast to the intellectual hurricane that sur*rounded the priest.

Where Garth had made them work for each book and machine, the priest gave freely. Garth had tried to be progressive in his supply of knowledge, treating them as bright but unlettered children. He had wanted them to walk before they could run, to master one step before going on to the next.

Father Mark simply brought them the benefits of Christianity. The only physical work he required was the construction of a church, a place of worship and learning. More Weskers had appeared out of the limitless planetary swamps and within days the roof was up, sup*ported on a framework of poles. Each morning the congregation worked a little while on the walls, then hurried inside to learn the all-promising, all-encompassing, all-important facts about the uni*verse.

Garth never told the Weskers what he thought about their new interest, and this was mainly because they had never asked him. Pride or honor stood in the way of his grabbing a willing listener and pour*ing out his grievances. Perhaps it would have been different if Itin was on Collecting duty, he was the brightest of the lot, but Itin had been rotated the day after the priest had arrived and Garth had not talked to him since.

It was a surprise then when after seventeen of the trebly-long Wes*ker days, he found a delegation at his doorstep when he emerged after breakfast. Itin was their spokesman, and his mouth was open slightly. Many of the other Weskers had their mouths open as well, one even appearing to be yawning, clearly revealing the double row of sharp teeth and the purple-black throat. The mouths impressed Garth as to the seriousness of the meeting: this was the one Wesker expression he had learned to recognize. An open mouth indicated some strong emotion: happiness, sadness, anger, he could never be really sure which. The Weskers were normally placid and he had never seen enough open mouths to tell what was causing them. But he was sur*rounded by them now.

“Will you help us, Garth?” Itin said. “We have a question.”

“I’ll answer any questions you ask,” Garth said, with more than a hint of misgiving. “What is it?”

“Is there a God?”

“What do you mean by ‘God’?” Garth asked in turn. What should he tell them? What had been going on in their minds that they should come to him with this question?

“God is our Father in Heaven, who made us all and protects us. Whom we pray to for aid, and if we are Saved will find a place—”

“That’s enough,” Garth said. “There is no God.”

All of them had their mouths open now, even Itin, as they looked at Garth and thought about his answer. The rows of pink teeth would have been frightening if he hadn’t known these creatures so well. For one instant he wondered if perhaps they had been already indoctri*nated and looked upon him as a heretic, but he brushed the thought away.

“Thank you,” Itin said, and they turned and left.

Though the morning was still cool, Garth noticed that he was sweating and wondered why.

The reaction was not long in coming. Itin returned that same af*ternoon. “Will you come to the church?” he asked. “Many of the things that we study are difficult to learn, but none as difficult as this. We need your help because we must hear you and Father Mark talk together. This is because he says one thing is true and you say another is true and both cannot be true at the same time. We must find out what is true.”

“I’ll come, of course,” Garth said, trying to hide the sudden feel*ing of elation. He had done nothing, but the Weskers had come to him anyway. There could still be grounds for hope that they might yet be free.

It was hot inside the church, and Garth was surprised at the num*ber of Weskers who were there, more than he had seen gathered at any one time before. There were many open mouths. Father Mark sat at a table covered with books. He looked unhappy but didn’t say any*thing when Garth came in. Garth spoke first.

“I hope you realize this is their idea—that they came to me of their own free will and asked me to come here?”

“I know that,” the priest said resignedly. “At times they can be very difficult. But they are learning and want to believe, and that is what is important.”

“Father Mark, Trader Garth, we need your help,” Itin said. “You both know many things that we do not know. You must help us come to religion, which is not an easy thing to do.” Garth started to say something, then changed his mind. Itin went on. “We have read the bibles and all the books that Father Mark gave us, and one thing is clear. We have discussed this and we are all agreed. These books are very different from the ones that Trader Garth gave us. In Trader Garth’s books there is the universe which we have not seen, and it goes on without God, for He is mentioned nowhere, we have searched very carefully. In Father Mark’s books He is everywhere and nothing can go without Him. One of these must be right and the other must be wrong. We do not know how this can be, but after we find out which is right then perhaps we will know. If God does not exist . . .”

“Of course He exists, my children,” Father Mark said in a voice of heartfelt intensity. “He is our Father in Heaven who has created us all . . .”

“Who created God?” Itin asked and the murmur ceased and every one of the Weskers watched Father Mark intensely. He recoiled a bit under the impact of their eyes, then smiled.

“Nothing created God, since He is the Creator. He always was—”

“If He always was in existence—why cannot the universe have always been in existence? Without having had a creator?” Itin broke in with a rush of words. The importance of the question was obvious. The priest answered slowly, with infinite patience.

“Would that the answers were that simple, my children. But even the scientists do not agree about the creation of the universe. While they doubt—we who have seen the light know. We can see the mir*acle of creation all about us. And how can there be a creation without a Creator? That is He, our Father, our God in Heaven. I know you have doubts and that is because you have souls and free will. Still the answer is simple. Have faith, that is all you need. Just believe.”

“How can we believe without proof?”

“If you cannot see that this world itself is proof of His existence, then I say to you that belief needs no proof—if you have faith!”

A babble of voices arose in the room and more of the Wesker mouths were open now as they tried to force their thoughts through the tangled skein of words and separate the thread of truth.

“Can you tell us, Garth?” Itin asked, and the sound of his voice quieted the hubbub.

“I can tell you to use the scientific method which can examine all things—including itself—and give you answers that can prove the truth or falsity of any statement.”

“That is what we must do,” Itin said. “We had reached the same conclusion.” He held a thick book before him and a ripple of nods ran across the watchers. “We have been studying the Bible as Father Mark told us to do, and we have found the answer. God will make a miracle for us, thereby proving that He is watching us. And by this sign we will know Him and go to Him.”

“This is a sign of false pride,” Father Mark said. “God needs no miracles to prove His existence.”

“But we need a miracle!” Itin shouted, and though he wasn’t hu*man there was still the cry of need in his voice. “We have read here of many smaller miracles, loaves, fishes, wine, snakes—many of them, for much smaller reasons. Now all He need do is make a mir*acle and He will bring us all to Him—the wonder of an entire new world worshiping at His throne, as you have told us, Father Mark. And you have told us how important this is. We have discussed this and find that there is only one miracle that is best for this kind of thing.”

His boredom and amused interest in the incessant theological wrangling drained from Garth in an instant. He had not been really thinking or he would have realized where all this was leading. By turning slightly he could see the illustration in the Bible where Itin held it open, and knew in advance what picture it was. He rose slowly from his chair, as if stretching, and turned to the priest behind him.

“Get ready!” he whispered. “Get out the back and get to the ship, I’ll keep them busy here. I don’t think they’ll harm—”

“What do you mean . . . ?” Father Mark asked, blinking in surprise.

“Get out, you fool!” Garth hissed. “What miracle do you think they mean? What miracle is supposed to have converted the world to Christianity?”

“No!” Father Mark said. “It cannot be. It just cannot—”

“GET MOVING!” Garth shouted, dragging the priest from the chair and hurling him towards the rear wall. Father Mark stumbled to a halt, turned back. Garth leaped for him, but it was already too late. The amphibians were small, but there were so many of them. Garth lashed out and his fist struck Itin, hurling him back into the crowd. The others came on as he fought his way towards the priest. He beat at them but it was like struggling against the waves. The furry, musky bodies washed over and engulfed him. He struggled un*til they tied him, and he still struggled until they beat on his head until he stopped. Then they pulled him outside, where he could only lie in the rain and curse and watch.

Of course the Weskers were marvelous craftsmen, and everything had been constructed down to the last detail, following the illustra*tion in the Bible. There was the cross, planted firmly on the top of a small hill, the gleaming metal spikes, the hammer. Father Mark was stripped and draped in a carefully pleated loincloth. They led him out of the church and at the sight of the cross he almost fainted. After that he held his head high and determined to die as he had lived, with faith.

Yet this was hard. It was unbearable even for Garth, who only watched. It is one thing to talk of crucifixion and look at the gentle carved bodies in the dim light of prayer. It is another to see a man naked, ropes cutting into his skin where he hangs from a bar of wood. And to see the needle-tipped spike raised and placed against the soft flesh of his palm, to see the hammer come back with the calm delib*eration of an artisan’s measured stroke. To hear the thick sound of metal penetrating flesh.

Then to hear the screams.

Few are born to be martyrs and Father Mark was not one of them. With the first blows, the blood ran from his lips where his clenched teeth met. Then his mouth was wide and his head strained back and the awful guttural horror of his screams sliced through the susurra*tion of the falling rain. It resounded as a silent echo from the masses of watching Weskers, for whatever emotion opened their mouths was now tearing at their bodies with all its force, and row after row of gaping jaws reflected the crucified priest’s agony.

Mercifully he fainted as the last nail was driven home. Blood ran from the raw wounds, mixing with the rain to drip faintly pink from his feet as the life ran out of him. At this time, somewhere at this time, sobbing and tearing at his own bonds, numbed from the blows on the head, Garth lost consciousness.

He awoke in his own warehouse and it was dark. Someone was cutting away the woven ropes they had bound him with. The rain still dripped and splashed outside.

“Itin,” he said. It could be no one else.

“Yes,” the alien voice whispered back. “The others are all talking in the church. Lin died after you struck his head, and Inon is very sick. There are some that say you should be crucified too, and I think that is what will happen. Or perhaps killed by stoning on the head. They have found in the Bible where it says—”

“I know.” With infinite weariness. “An eye for an eye. You’ll find lots of things like that once you start looking.”

“You must go, you can get to your ship without anyone seeing you. There has been enough killing.” Itin as well spoke with a new*found weariness.

Garth experimented, pulling himself to his feet. He pressed his head to the rough wall until the nausea stopped.

“He’s dead.” He said it as a statement, not a question.

“Yes, some time ago. Or I could not have come away to see you.”

“And buried of course, or they wouldn’t be thinking about starting on me next.”

“And buried!” There was almost a ring of emotion in the alien’s voice, an echo of the dead priest’s. “He is buried and he will rise on High. It is written and that is the way it will happen. Father Mark will be so happy that it has happened like this.” The voice ended in a sound like a human sob, but of course it couldn’t have been that since Itin was alien, and not human at all. Garth painfully worked his way towards the door, leaning against the wall so he wouldn’t fall.

“We did the right thing, didn’t we?” Itin asked. There was no an*swer. “He will rise up, Garth, won’t he rise?”

Garth was at the door and enough light came from the brightly lit church to show his torn and bloody hands clutching at the frame. Itin’s face swam into sight close to his, and Garth felt the delicate, many-fingered hands with the sharp nails catch at his clothes.

“He will rise, won’t he, Garth?”

“No,” Garth said, “he is going to stay buried right where you put him. Nothing is going to happen, because he is dead and he is going to stay dead.”

The rain runneled through Itin’s fur and his mouth was opened so wide that he seemed to be screaming into the night. Only with effort could he talk, squeezing out the alien thoughts in an alien language.

“Then we will not be saved? We will not become pure?”

“You were pure,” Garth said, in a voice somewhere between a sob and a laugh. “That’s the horrible ugly dirty part of it. You were pure. Now you are—”

“Murderers,” Itin said, and the water ran down from his lowered head and streamed away into the darkness.

but this is not Wesker's world, friends

I have been reading this discussion and I am not expecting this to reach any conclusion.
I don't think my these fellow members have slight knowledge of past history. I you have, you discussions proving it quite contrary.
You are referring again and again to Google it, Google it.
I am now requesting you to Google it.
Why there was need for a separate Muslim state in Hindu dominated United India?
What was the prime force behind the Pakistan movement?
Everyone knows how Muslims were targeted by Britains in collusion with Hindus and how Muslims were persecuted.
It was Islam which United Muslims to get rid of Hindu dominance and persecution.
Now Islamic Republic of Pakistan is established on wishes of Muslims.
What is democracy?
Democracy is the will of majority. If the will of majority in Pakistan is to retain Islamic Identity, then microscopic minority has not legal right to impose their will on majority. No one will not allow minority to rule and dominate the majority.
Regarding the safety and security of Minority lives, houses and worship places, it is worthy to note that they are much safer in Pakistan than Muslims. Terrorist are not sparing the mosques and other holy places. Who are these terrorists? And who is financing and supporting them? It is crystal clear to everyone and everyone knows it but some people pretend and blame everything on Islam and Musalman.
Those people don't know what actually Islam stands for. Islam doesn't allow violence and terrorism.
Those who are using violence for propagation of islam do not have slight knowledge that in Islam there is no forceful conversion.
Some people even call khulifa e rashidin Dictators but those Dictators are much better than contemporary Pious Rajas and Maharajas. Khalifas used force for territorial gains in order to preserve peace and get rid of belligerent neighbours. Furthermore territorial aggrandisement was general trend in that time.
Regarding Jizya it is better to notedown that it was not a discriminatory tax. It was taken from non Muslims in lieu of military services and for protection and safety of non Muslims. There were many categories who were exempted from Jizya e.g brahmans, children etc. Furthermore Muslims were required to pay Fitrana, Zakat etc but non Muslims were exempted from these taxes.
Now back in Pakistan, some people are associating terrorist attacks and terrorism with Islam. For God sake, Islam is not supporting violence and what we are suffering in Pakistan is result of conspiracy and some wrong policies of our military dictators. Even Mosques are not safe let kept aside the churches and temples.
In Islamic country of Pakistan minorities are much safer than minorities particularly Muslims in Secular India.
In Pakistan minorities are granted special protection and in Jobs admissions and other services minorities are granted special quota.
In democracy minority follow the majority. So you should expect Rana Bhagwan Das to pledge to protect the identify and mandate of majority.
Regards

My dear fellas
How you are expecting us as Muslim state to Ban Cow Slaughtering when even so called model states of Europe and America are not banning.
First of all, convince them. We shall follow the suit.
Regards

__________________
Visions and ideals are like stars,we never reach them; but like mariners over sea,we can chart our course by them.

Very wrong interpretation of democracy. There is something called Tyranny of the majority. Yes, Google it.

Minorities disagree.

Children were exempted from Jizya!! That's awesome! So humane!

Does democracy work this way in the West? Does a Muslim pledge to protect Christian ideology? Why should it happen here?

The West is convinced of separating religion and politics. We shall follow suit.

They are a cult of Hindu Goddess Kali. They believe that when they die in a suicide attack they will go directly to Sawarg where voluptuous maidens are waiting, and there will be drunken orgies in Sawarg. But for that you have to first blow yourself up.

__________________
He that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow (Ecclesiastes 1:18)

And my dear but uneasy friend, who is brain washing the illiterate and common man. Who is financing these terrorists and terrorism. I think you are not in touch with intelligence sharing by our secret services. You have simple and easy answers Mullahs and Islam.
A typical Indian outlook.

I am talking about cow Slaughtering. The west is wise enough that they found no logic behind banning cow Slaughtering.
Regards

__________________
Visions and ideals are like stars,we never reach them; but like mariners over sea,we can chart our course by them.

Mullahs and faulty interpretation of Islam yes.

But I have shared the intelligence report with you: they are a cult of Kali.



The west is wise enough just for that? For other things like separating religion and politics is it unwise? That's called cherry picking

Glad you find it disgusting

__________________
He that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow (Ecclesiastes 1:18)

If someone asks irrelevant questions, ‘Google it’ seems to be the most appropriate answer. It’s good to have a conversation that sticks to the point, although I understand it’s hard for us to appreciate it.

So what Muslims decided was to get their own land and impose official religious ideology on everyone and lose half the country within 25 years (we live in a half-a-castle of Islam) and make the rest a complete mess. Remarkable strategy, I must say.

Of course. Would you say that the members of this majority have the same picture of this “Islamic Pakistan” in their minds? And no one is asking the minority to impose its will on the majority anywhere. A tip: people who have spoken against the ills of their own societies have always been in minority. Only they turned out to be right.

Evidence suggests otherwise.

Who, indeed? You are aware of history, right? It’s just that the prodigal brothers of Islam have gotten out of hands. The terrorist that we hatched for our grand conquests have come back to impose their own design on us.

The responsibility seems to be the prerogative of army, the ‘defenders of our ideological frontiers’. And economically, the pious people of Pakistan generously donate for the causes of Kashmir Jihad and such. People also have deepest sympathies for what the Taliban did in Afghanistan (the good taliban). So there’s the chief source of finance and support. Only now people are more confused than ever. They can’t make sense of what their Islamic warriors are doing to them, blowing mosques and all. So they’re twisting and turning the ‘Islamic ideology’ only to make their confusion worse.

Yeah, the chief source of support is crystal clear, as I explained above. And it’s always advisable to keep in view the difference between criticizing Islam and criticizing the medieval interpretations of the same. I know, it’s futile to explain things to patriot Pakistanis but all one can do is try.

Oh I’m sorry, but those people know more about Islam more than you and I. Only they are the practical implementation of the medieval Islam whose image we cherish in our minds. It’s just that we don’t feel the methods are appropriate.

Right, there is no forced conversion in Islam, but Muslims (Pakistanis being at the forefront) have a rich history of the same. (I didn’t blame Islam, see?)

I’ll tell you why they are doing that. Because the terrorists derive their inspiration from the medieval interpretations of Islam (remember the famous fatwa of Imam Ibn-e-Taimiyyah which happens to be the favorite of the Taliban and Bin Laden?). You might not agree with those interpretations, but tell me, how many Pakistan ulemas have openly denounced the Taliban? It’s only recent that the soldiers who died were refused to be called martyrs, isn’t it? Was it some Indian who did that or was that the leader of one of the most popular religious political parties? Your religious leaders don’t have any problem with what the Taliban stand for (they just think the path of suicide bombing is rather unpleasant to achieve the same ends) so it won’t make slightest difference if a common educated man like you or me keeps chanting that this is not Islam. If this is not Islam, have it say out loud by the ulemas. If they don’t do it, then this really is Islam for the rest of the world. If you care to see, it really is crystal clear where the main support base of the terrorists is.

Because sectarianism is another gift of religious politics and the policies of Jehad in the neighboring countries. Our jihadi boys are just experimenting with new things, you see.

Let’s compare Pakistan with the worst country in the world and feel terribly happy about it.

Free cigarettes, please?

It’s all right if you borrow my lines. But it’s good to be original once in a while.

Umm, well, may be?

Nothing, really.

Congratulations, again.

Just what I said above, let’s compare Pakistan with the worst country in the world and feel happy about it. Let’s take the moral reasoning of ancient clueless people and compare it to today’s Pakistan and celebrate about our superiority. Let’s adopt the colonial mentality of medieval ages and invade the smaller countries. That’s what are doing right? Comparing and justifying ourselves with bad examples and feeling great instead of trying to improve with the good examples. I like this interesting part of the confusion which I hinted above. Very interesting.

It’s not for anyone here to teach proper interpretations of Islam. If the people who have a monopoly on Islam have no bother with the Talibanist interpretations, then that is what the world will continue to take as Islam.

Yes disciples of Kali are responsible for bad image of Pakistan and Islam. RSS, RAW and Indian Hindus are using every opportunity to oust and topple Pakistan.
I am compelled to conclude that a Hindu mind can never ever accept Pakistan.
I just browsed Dawnnews.com and in comments I read Indian readers have same disgust and hatred that I found in yours comments and remarks against Pakistan and Islam.
This all is the result of freedom you are enjoying here and still you are ungrateful.
And let keep one thing in your mind, we will never ever allow anybody to deprive us of our Islamic Identity. Pakistan and Islam are indispensable for each other.
Regards

__________________
Visions and ideals are like stars,we never reach them; but like mariners over sea,we can chart our course by them.

[QUOTE=Gypsified;744111]If someone asks irrelevant questions, ‘Google it’ seems to be the most appropriate answer. It’s good to have a conversation that sticks to the point, although I understand it’s hard for us to appreciate it.

Don't throw everything for Google. Use it and let us know.

So what Muslims decided was to get their own land and impose official religious ideology on everyone and lose half the country within 25 years (we live in a half-a-castle of Islam) and make the rest a complete mess. Remarkable strategy, I must say.

That is a long debate. Now what we have after 67 years of independence is thanked to our selfish leaders and India.

Of course. Would you say that the members of this majority have the same picture of this “Islamic Pakistan” in their minds? And no one is asking the minority to impose its will on the majority anywhere. A tip: people who have spoken against the ills of their own societies have always been in minority. Only they turned out to be right.

Constructive criticism is welcome but I don't smell any positivity in your criticism. Yes majority of members are satisfied with Islamic Republic of Pakistan.

Evidence suggests otherwise.

What kind of evidence you are suggesting? Like other Minorities Muslims are too victim of terrorism.

Who, indeed? You are aware of history, right? It’s just that the prodigal brothers of Islam have gotten out of hands. The terrorist that we hatched for our grand conquests have come back to impose their own design on us.

I admit that it was failure of our policies. India exploited what we forget to cleanse. But at present India is prime factor behind unstable Pakistan in addition to our leaders.

The responsibility seems to be the prerogative of army, the ‘defenders of our ideological frontiers’. And economically, the pious people of Pakistan generously donate for the causes of Kashmir Jihad and such. People also have deepest sympathies for what the Taliban did in Afghanistan (the good taliban). So there’s the chief source of finance and support. Only now people are more confused than ever. They can’t make sense of what their Islamic warriors are doing to them, blowing mosques and all. So they’re twisting and turning the ‘Islamic ideology’ only to make their confusion worse.

Now who is financing? Definitely foreign involvement.
Whoever is carring the banner of so called Jihad has personal motives or other than religious.

Yeah, the chief source of support is crystal clear, as I explained above. And it’s always advisable to keep in view the difference between criticizing Islam and criticizing the medieval interpretations of the same. I know, it’s futile to explain things to patriot Pakistanis but all one can do is try.

So you are not patriot.

Oh I’m sorry, but those people know more about Islam more than you and I. Only they are the practical implementation of the medieval Islam whose image we cherish in our minds. It’s just that we don’t feel the methods are appropriate.

It is a wrong policy to pass a statement about 2 billion Muslims by analyzing just a few bandits. Again and again we deny our support or any affiliation.

Right, there is no forced conversion in Islam, but Muslims (Pakistanis being at the forefront) have a rich history of the same. (I didn’t blame Islam, see?)

Exceptions do occur. What you are stating is happening everywhere.

I’ll tell you why they are doing that. Because the terrorists derive their inspiration from the medieval interpretations of Islam (remember the famous fatwa of Imam Ibn-e-Taimiyyah which happens to be the favorite of the Taliban and Bin Laden?). You might not agree with those interpretations, but tell me, how many Pakistan ulemas have openly denounced the Taliban? It’s only recent that the soldiers who died were refused to be called martyrs, isn’t it? Was it some Indian who did that or was that the leader of one of the most popular religious political parties? Your religious leaders don’t have any problem with what the Taliban stand for (they just think the path of suicide bombing is rather unpleasant to achieve the same ends) so it won’t make slightest difference if a common educated man like you or me keeps chanting that this is not Islam. If this is not Islam, have it say out loud by the ulemas. If they don’t do it, then this really is Islam for the rest of the world. If you care to see, it really is crystal clear where the main support base of the terrorists is.

Medieval interpretations are not valid now. They were valid for that particular time. Now situation is quite different. Ulemas are already depicting them as terrorist. Majority of sunni and shiiate ulemas has Issued fatwas against them. Our opposition against terrorism does not require explanation as we are in mid of Operation Zarb e Azb.

Because sectarianism is another gift of religious politics and the policies of Jehad in the neighboring countries. Our jihadi boys are just experimenting with new things, you see.

Sectarianism is everywhere. Hindus have four castes. Christians also have. A Catholic can not rule some countries as king.

Let’s compare Pakistan with the worst country in the world and feel terribly happy about it.

Why not compare Pakistan with India when we have so many things in common especially rivalry.

Free cigarettes, please?

Dunhill or Gold Leaf?

__________________
Visions and ideals are like stars,we never reach them; but like mariners over sea,we can chart our course by them.

Long debate, I agree. And what do we do when someone keeps pestering us with questions about lengthy irrelevant debates. We suggest the use of Google, because we are not here to spoon-feed the babies.

Historical evidence.

Well, the financial support might have dwindled (that too, because of foreign pressure and not out of our own conviction) but the moral support is in full swing as always. Let me know of prominent ulemas and leaders of religious parties who have openly denounced the medieval interpretations of Islam by the Taliban. They in fact agree with them. We were having debates about whether medieval interpretation of Shariah should be adopted in Pakistan, with people like Molana Abdul Aziz sahab (one of the spiritual fathers of terrorists) being invited as guests only recently. Molana Sami-ul-Haq, Fazl-ur-Rehman, Jamat-e-Islami, look where you feel like, you'll find great deal of support for the Taliban. And the same thing is reflected in ordinary Pakistanis. They are all right with what the Taliban stand far, they just don't feel comfortable with suicide bombings when they come to their own country.

Of course this is what you and I say, and I appreciate the gesture. Unfortunately, the people who run Islam as a corporation, the ulemas, don't agree with you. Convince them, if you may.

You mean different castes of Hindus are going in each others' temples and blowing themselves up? That Catholics and Protestants are issuing fatwas against each other and offering wholesale killing based on sects? I see. You do know about history, right?

All right. We both have religious riots, we are even in that glorious accomplishment. Let's move on more comparisons. Muslims can built new mosques, preach their religion and seek converts, have separate laws enacted for them, can become the heads of the state et all. How much of this do the minorities in Pakistan have?

That was the only thing that amused me. Well, I'm ambivalent. I keep switching between the two.

And there's something more. Let's not throw around the terms like anti-Islam and anti-Pakistan (which is a bad thing to do in an argument, anyways). Let's first try to understand the fact that whether someone favors a religious model of the state or secular, they only want a better Pakistan, according to their own understanding. There might be flaw in the understanding, but swiftly labeling the person as anti-Islam and anti-Pakistan (when the actual anti-Islam and anti-Pakistanis are our beloved Taliban) is hardly a mature thing to do.